Hi everyone,
In week 5 it's going to be another bumper discussion! Lectures will be introducing us to the rise of two important components of late medieval urban life: communes and universities. The twelfth and thirteenth centuries saw the foundation of some of the most famous universities in Europe, for example, these two, which in some ways still look as though one might bump into a medieval student around any given corner...
And in tutorials we will be discussing universities and education in more detail. In particular, we'll use the story of the two people pictured below
as a juicy entrée into issues related to education at the time. Think about Abelard's
Historia Calamitatum in light of the questions in the reading guide. What does his story tell us about intellectual and philosophical life and thought in twelfth-century France (apart from some pretty gory things about castration...)? If the extract whets your appetite, or you just want to know
Heloise's side of the story (!), look for their letters which are published in various editions and
available in the library; or look for the works of Monash's own
Professor Constant Mews, who is a world expert on their correspondence.
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| Abelard & Heloise |
27 comments:
Having been to Cambridge myself, I just want to stress how phenomenal it is. Not only is it the university itself that is impressive, but the whole town is entirely centred around the university. It is truly amazing and I would encourage everyone to go there at least once in their lives!
Yes! It is lovely. (I am probably bound by some kind of statute to denigrate it as "the other place"; but I am above such petty rivalries. Mostly.) :-)
Those of you who have visited Cambridge or Oxford probably took note of the fact that the colleges are all fiercely separate and private. They began as independent 'schools' where masters could live and work communally, and overcome the financial burdens that might have made teaching and learning impossible. My own old college, University, was founded in 1249 by the bequest of William of Durham, an Englishman who had taught theology in Paris, to provide a living for masters who weren't already associated with a monastic order. It was difficult for individuals without wealthy support, like a patron or a religious order, to finance the long degree process. And no matter what Abelard says about his popularity, there wasn't exactly a fortune to be made teaching theology.
The structure of college life echoes back to the period we're discussing (although most of the buildings are a few centuries newer), in which communal living is arranged somewhat after the model of monks or canons. 'Oxbridge' architechture shows us this link quite closely. The colleges are normally bound by high walls, secluded from the street, and situated around quadrangles not unlike the layout of the cloister in the map of St Gall we looked at a couple of weeks ago. Other resemblances - no doubt deliberately preservedby these places that value tradition so highly - can be found in things like the common name for the college dining hall, often 'the refectory'.
It all seems to be sending a certain subliminal message about the nature of learning and the kind of committment and separation from the world it takes. How much do you think Abelard would have agreed?
It seems interesting how universities developed. I found it interesting to see their development from being lectures in rented rooms to being in such grand situations. It would also have been an interesting time to live given the ideas we are brought up on and taught were being developed and argued about at this stage. Interesting to see the rivalries that developed between scholars
I meant to say institutions not situations.
continuing on Lauren's thread...have been luck enough to visit Oxford a couple of years ago and despite the clear rivalries held between these universities and the subsequent seclusion from each other, there remains something very similar; the whole town of Oxford really is centred around the university.
Could this be saying something about the reverence held for education in these societies from a very early period? That is, a town which is formed from a university is something quite remarkable.
Interestingly, there were often conflicts - even violent ones - between the 'town' and the 'gown' (i.e. scholars). Perhaps as universities grew and became institutionalised, they became the economic engines of the surrounding town, and so the town couldn't do without them; but they sometimes wanted to. It wasn't always a happy union. In 1273, for instance, the bishop of Hereford sent a letter to the chancellor of England asking him to discipline the masters and scholars of Oxford (who had been rioting) and not to go too easy on them. [That chancellor was Walter de Merton, who had actually founded his own college there... remember the bells from last week!?]
Such violence wasn't even a particularly uncommon occurrence. [And this puts Abelard's troubles into a slightly wider context, I think!] They story goes that Cambridge was actually founded by some masters who fled Oxford during one these riots, and decided not to go back; and that Oxford itself had basically grown up as a place of refuge for scholars fleeing a similar rash of rioting in Paris... So it would be lovely to conclude that the only reason for the development of these 'university towns' was the social value of learning; but I think it must have been a lot more complicated than that!
In the readings for this week, I found it interesting to learn of the transformations that occured in response to the rising demand for education and instituions of education. Moreover, how monastic schools intensified their curicula, cathedral schools taught more, more students and individual masters opened their own schools and Arabic began to circulate in Latin translations. Thus establishing the beginnings of the first universities, encompasing the very foundations of Cambridge University.
I found it interesting how the Universities came about. It was also fascinating as to how vicious scholars of the time could be when one of their students threatened to surpass them. There was a lot of backstabbing and meddling to try to hold the student back or shame them so they could not succeed.
In the piece on Abelard and Heloise I found a couple of discrepencies. In one version it was said that Fulbert found out about the marriage after it had been completed and then had Abelard beat and castrated. Also it sounded as if the marriage was an act of love. In the other version Fulbert knew about the marriage and was present then went after Abelard still because he had betrayed him. And in this version Heloise was completely against the marriage saying it would destroy them both.
Well spotted, Erika. In fact, Heloise herself described her feelings towards marriage as reluctance in her earliest surviving letter to Abelard. She said: "God knows I never sought anything in you except yourself... I looked for no marriage-bond, no marriage portion, and it was not my own pleasures and wishes I sought to gratify, as you well know, but yours. The name of wife may seem more sacred or binding, but sweeter for me will always be the word mistress, or, if you will permit me, that of concubine of whore. I believed that the more I humbled myself on your account, the more gratitude I should win from you, and also the less damage I should do to the brightness of your reputation." (From the Radice translation, The Letters of Abelard and Heloise, Penguin: London, 1974, p.113.)
All of which raises the question: why did they marry? Any ideas?
I also found the origins of the universities really interesting. I spent some time on wikipedia after I read the readings and had no idea how far back Oxford and Cambridge go. I wonder what the first graduation might have been like? That would be a crazy class picture haha.
On the topic of Abelard and Heloise, I think perhaps the marriage was spurred on due to more of a social pressure kind of thing. After all Abelard got Heloise pregnant so I would assume having a child out of wedlock might not bode too well for his career and Fulbert wasnt too pleased.
It also feels like Abelard sort of talks too much that it gets him in trouble. He doesnt seem like the kind of type that likes to keep things to himself or if he does, cant keep it secret for very long. He goes around sort of bragging about his fling with Heloise and he's even writing that letter about his castration. If it was me, not something I'd be telling people haha. I think marriage was probably the most logical thing for him to want to do since if they didnt marry and just kept their affair secret, I dont think he could have kept it secret for very long.
It's tragic how someone with such a 'razor sharp' intellect on the 'cutting edge' of his field fell 'short' in the prime of his life I suppose sometimes love tends to wound people in their most vulnerable of areas... their hearts!
I would just like to say how interested I am in the Abelard and Heloise love story! It's so interesting how the fell in love over learning and how many obstacles they had to face to be together from family to pregnancy! I can't wait to find out more
Stephanie Dumble
Hi Rosslyn here, commenting on the Abelard and Heloise saga from the Historia Calamitatum article. Why did they marry? I think to make amends with the uncle to get back in favour, it was Ok if it was kept a secret and what about the comment 'since the beginning of the human race women have brought the noblest of men to ruin'. I think if there was a medieval psychologist in the university he might get the label of having a narcissistic disorder. His quest to prove his superior intellignece, his masters violent dislike of him, others jealousy of his 'capacities' and when he stumbles over a woman/girl who has perhaps a better mind than he and as his says 'in looks she did not rank the lowest' set about taken her out as a rival. Servitude was not for her and gazing at her letters she calls herself a hypocrite for its not the celebration of mass that sends a light through her body but is her thoughts of Abelard and her memories. What happened to Astralabe? Did he go on to invent a new form of marine navigation? joke... boy, castration, he got off lightly I think.
Hi Ross,
Astrolabe (perhaps the earliest known incidence of 'celebrity baby name syndrome' ;p) drops out of the records pretty quickly, although some of Heloise's correspondence with Peter the Venerable shows that she asked him to secure a prebend (i.e. land granted to a canon of a cathedral to support them financially) for Astrolabe, and he (Peter) promised to try. I don't know if there's any evidence as to whether he was successful.
The centrality of a university in a society during this time period seems to be a key concept. This makes sense considering the grandness of these two universities in particular which the town surrounds but also that the univerisities housed the intellectuals and educated people during the era. You can understand why a town and infostructure would arise around an area with a higher level of educated people
-tom crowe
I found the great importance and interest that some of the knights placed in education if not for themsleves for their children interesting.
Yes - this is a curious and surprising point, isn't it, Nathan!? We sort of begin from the assumption that the knights just got on with fighting, and left learning and literacy to other people. Abelard's story is one piece of evidence that shows us that this model is too simplistic.
I must say, it's no wonder that universities and schools created tension within the lower classes. When through the Authenticum Habita students were presented free travel and legal immunities, on top of the protection scholars already possessed.
Although quite a logical beginning I'd never thought of Universities existing "only legally, not physically". It would be verrryyy different now if we were to go to your house for tutes Kathleen haha. How long would it have taken the University campuses to appear as an early stage of how we see them now?
Just another little point- Abelard reminds me so much of Socrates in that his piety was in doubt and he claimed he outsmarted his masters and fellow students, which results in jealousy, annoyance and deslike. For Socrates it ended in death. Not convinced castration is a whole lot better, not that his castration came from his "superior" intellect but rather his lack of
-Anna Morris
Hello everyone, Kellie here.
I found Abelard and Heloise’ story quite disturbing in many ways. The well entrenched idea that marriage somehow makes your brain leak out so that you can no longer be a philosopher was a real eye opener. I thought the medieval bans on students and masters of Universities having relationships with women were related to their ecclesiastic relations. (Masters taking minor orders etc.) I had no idea; they considered sex such a malignant force against intellectual pursuit.
Abelard’s actions in marrying Heloise and then whisking her off to a convent seemed downright sneaky to me. He comes across as so thoroughly unlikable and self-centred, it is hard not to suspect him of tidying the Heloise problem up to his benefit, with little thought for her well being.
I also found Abelard’s comments on entering the abbey of St Denis out of shame and remorse, rather than religious devotion interesting as our week 2 tute outlined how enthusiastically people were “tested” before being admitted to monasteries.
It struck me how university from its creation became such an essential part of the Medieval world.I had always been of the assumption that it had merely started and progressed during this period. Was there much conflict/competition between the universities of the time?
One event that I find interesting, relating to the emergence of medieval universities, is the founding of Cambridge. It was founded by the more radical Oxford professors after being subjected to violence by the townsfolk, who accused them of treason against the king. So even at that time univeristies were places of reform and innovation that challenged the status quo.
It interested me this week to learn about the conflicts between scripture and logic in the 11th to 12th centuries and how different types of schools were separated by their willingness to embrace logic, which was seemingly a foreign, controversial concept at the time.
I hadn’t thought about the links that Peters drew between law and changes in thought brought about by education before, but it makes a lot of sense. Some serious changes have to take place to go from a legal system where the guilty were often determined by ‘divine’ judgement to trials and courtrooms and judgement determined by evidence instead.
The development of logic led to making the law more systematic and rational, which could not have been the case if there had not be scholars dedicated to educating students in different ways of thinking. A more universal method of practicing the law would have benefited many people and also fed back into making institutions such as universities possible and justifiable.
Jennifer Stephens
Hello all!
With the reading on Abelard and Heloise, I think Abelard must have been a real pain to have as a student - he comes across as a bit too smart for his own good, and doesn't seem to have learned until too late that sometimes, it's better to keep your mouth shut. He seemed to be veering between a smug tone of self-superiority and then acting shocked and wounded when his teachers got cross that he regularly showed them up...not exactly the wisest thing to have done. I can't exactly say I blame them in hounding him around the country.
Also, his long description of Heloise's objections to the marriage I found somewhat suspicious - I wonder if she was truly had such high ideals as he paints out, or if, as he mentions right at the end of the speech, 'who can concentrate on thoughts of Scripture or philosophy and be able to endure babies crying, etc etc' -
However, I will say that this week was an interesting reading!
Heya, Chelsea here. I also found it really interesting reading about the conflicts between scripture and logic in the 11th to 12th centuries. It seems like some people/schools had massive struggles with accepting the things they were learning.
Georgia says:
'Going through the readings I found it really interesting that while universities and 'schools' were becoming more popular and widespread, there were particular people who were very influential and popular and came from various backgrounds. It was also interesting to note how women were becoming more involved in the educational process despite the fact that it didn't change their status in society.'
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